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T.H. Any reading into, implication or accusation in this thread is not coming from me. I asked Pete, in the first part, to clarify what point he is attempting to make. You may feel confident you know, but I prefer to ask Pete to better state his point. I secondly asked you to weigh your point, clearly made, against the rules of racing. It is you who are expressing sensitivity to your initial comment. Pete on the other hand has not responded. The RRS may be open to interpretation but one’s interpretation speaks volumes about their point of view. I choose to believe the following: there is a distinction between knowingly breaking a rule – intentionally or not – and having done so without realizing it. I accuse neither you nor Pete of having done either. I further believe that it doesn’t matter the circumstance, and the rules rightly don’t distinguish between a)professional & non-professional events, B)between red & white hulls, between green or black shirts, c)whether an official (PRO, IJ or line judge) sees, there is no such thing as partial integrity or even temporary suspension of integrity. To err is human, to penalize one’s self is divine. Play by the rules or don’t play at all.

Hi again; Sorry for the confusion. John, your stance on integrity is very well taken in the abstract, but I think the “alls fair” comment was mis-taken a little bit however, as it was more of a casual, dare I say philosophical observation in response to the article. It was absolutely NOT direct advice to people to cheat. To immediately take it that way seems a bit sensitive, naive, or rushing to judgment on your part. However I do of course respect the idea that we should respect the sport.

Let me clarify, if even now you still somehow question my personal integrity or my ability to read a rule book: I do not advocate cheating. However, if we have to be completely on the high road, doesn’t this very article imply, in several places, that being part of the herd (disguising your identity) is good, regardless of whether or not you are actually over? Should we not allow competitors to wear the same clothing and all use white boats?

Have I heard of people turning themselves in? Sure John, I have. Many times. I have done it myself. Have you (turned yourself in), every single time? How do you know you have? Maybe you were really over once or twice in an individual recall? By your logic, even if you thought you might be, then you really needed to go restart to fulfill your integrity. At the US Open, if the ball was outside the line, does the person winning the point always stop the game, argue against themselves, and give up the point?? Should they? Sure. Do they? Almost never. They rely on the official to make the call, and have to, right or wrong. You must dislike Derek Jeter now for sure, for faking being hit by a pitch so he could get on base for his team. Maybe Instant reply in the NFL is totally unnecessary; just tell the wide receivers not to fake, or imply, catching passes if the ball really, honestly, did hit the ground first.  Instant replay, realistically, and practically, is an attempt to safeguard as much fair play as possible. There are endless of examples of this not only in sport but other walks of life. Yeah, it’d be great if everyone turned themselves in for even thinking they may have possibly done something wrong…. or maybe it wouldn’t be great, come to think of it. But in reality, it doesn’t happen.

Perhaps you have heard of 80+ boat world championship regattas, or even sailed in some of them, as I have, where surely there were boats that were missed being called that were over early, that sailed the race anyway, kept that score, and maybe even won the event. Are they breaking whatever rule you copied and pasted? I think what Pete is simply advocating here, a point you first seemed also to criticize, and now back away from after Ben’s comment, is that more information is better than less, and knowing what it going on, on the committee boat, from a competitors point of view, helps you make better decisions. That’s more the real world. And yes, sometimes at the professional level, “all’s fair in love, war, and winning a regatta.”

Ben, Initially I asked for clarification on the point Pete is seeking to make. I am more than willing to give him the benefit of doubt that he is not advocating purposefully breaking rules. However I do take issue with T.H.’s comment that ‘alls fair’ as long as you’re not caught. Be aggressive and get a great start, absolutely. But know you’re OCS and not restart is not in keeping with the spirit of the game no matter what happens on the signal boat.

John, It seems to me that your argument is based on the fact that the sailor knows that he/she is over! It is impossible for a sailor to know exactly where they are relative to the starting line at the starting signal… Lets say you are sailing in a large fleet of 24 foot sloops. The starting line might be well over 1000 feet long. Are you going to be able to determine if you were over by 18 inches?! Almost every sailor has had a race in their life where they came of the line thinking, “holy cow, I’m launched, I must have been over.” Are you suggesting they should retire or restart immediately to show good sportsmanship? I’ve known Pete for a while — He’s definitely not advising sailors to try get away with anything.

T.H. please tell how you reconcile your opinion: …alls fair in love, war, and starting a sailboat race without penalty…. with the racing rules of sailing: 2 FAIR SAILING A boat and her owner shall compete in compliance with recognized principles of sportsmanship and fair play. Perhaps you have heard stories of competitors, having broken a rule without being ‘caught’, still take their penalty? Corinthian spirit, respect for yourself and your competitors. Please think about it.